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    BOTS3 Discussion *SPOILERS*

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    JGZinv
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    BOTS3 Discussion *SPOILERS*

    Post by JGZinv on 10/15/2009, 1:01 am

    Well having watched the bento version of the movie...

    I'm not sure what to say. On one hand is was a good ending, but a very sad ending.

    I can understand why AN died like it did after the movie came out, plus the
    internal problems... a lot of that makes sense now. There wasn't much to talk about
    further... the largest topics were nailed dead due to the movie wrapping up ties.


    Of course we're still here...

    But some observations:

    Lafiel and Jinto have an understood love for each other. Jinto being softer on the outside, harder on the inside... while Lafiel is the reverse. They've evidently decided on children.

    Their relationship has changed after him nearly dying on Lobnas II, and also it appears to have changed some due to age. I'd almost say that Lafiel, and maybe it's the Japanese language verses listening to the dub, but was hard and bitter. Very few times unless they were "having a moment" did she display as much as previous animations. I was sort of taken aback by this... wishing for the desperate emotional Lafiel.

    The exchange about her needing a disguise again, and the flashbacks, was one of the best scenes.

    Miss. E (since I can't spell her name) drives like a psychopath, and seems to have shed her cutesy exterior in favor of being blunt, kinda rude, and addicted to speed. Pretty sure she was hoping Jinto would do something to her in the "dead" communication's ship.

    Ultimately I just about had a heart attack at the ending when Till wanted him to seek asylum and abandon the Abh. The concept sent me into a shock, hoping he wouldn't consider it. The next scene flashed through - or maybe it was poor editing... faster than I could really grasp what had happened and suddenly they were to the point of signing documents.

    Till is a low down dirty.... whatever.. from what I remember he actually helped turn Rock Lin over to have him murdered. Now he spins the story like he was a saint. He corner's Jinto, taking away that which he had longed for so dearly... not just for himself, but to be with Lafiel on his home world. Till sickens me. It was entirely a power play by him to retain his power over Martine... he cared nothing for Jinto, even with the hugging. To even go so far as to even banish him from the area...

    Ultimately as Jinto said, he made his choice a long time ago... and more than the world he grew up on... he desired Lafiel's presence.

    The ending song was rather sad.. and the fact that the closing words were not of Lafiel's design... sort of made it feel a little hollow.

    To know that Jinto was left as a man without a country (read the book sometime) but had found a greater love was ending on a good note.

    To say goodbye to the series (as the entire ending was I felt, a send off to the anime fans), in such a fashion sort of makes me wish there were more "adventures of Jinto and Lafiel" - instead of being left to imagine a broken Jinto growing old against Lafiel.. always bound to her duty.

    Yet that vision might be offset by knowing they would have children, that might do better.... perhaps bring some measure of joy to them... is a good thought. Maybe the flower, as it showed at the end, having bloomed again... signified a rebirth...

    The Abh obviously will win the war... although that leaves fans no where basically...

    It just left me a with a rather conflicted ending... but one I suppose we could have seen coming a long time ago.



    Personally after blowing up the Martine laser.. I'd have told Till to leave or something. I can't see a "good way" out of the situation as long as you maintain that Martine is to come to no harm in any fashion. What you need is basically a assassination... so Jinto could return and open Martine's borders.

    *sigh*


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    Re: BOTS3 Discussion *SPOILERS*

    Post by Almael on 10/15/2009, 7:33 am

    I guess you summed up the possible intention of the anime.

    For the novel it sure was just closing the chapter on Martine and jinto's home in order to start on the bigger Empire picture.

    As to Till, he sure is not your common man, I mean he is able to grab power under the UMK.
    Even if the UMK say they support democracy, they are likely to have some puppet there.
    But he obviously beat them....
    Martine is democratic, and laws are passed through their 'congress' so Jinto is effectively banned forever.

    I agree on Jintos and Lafiel future, this is pretty much plain certain.
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    Re: BOTS3 Discussion *SPOILERS*

    Post by tanis1lionheart on 10/15/2009, 10:47 am

    So, there's no talk of BotS4?

    Sad

    I know it takes a while, given the series unpopularity, for an anime to come out, but I thought there was still a slim chance at continuing the story.
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    Re: BOTS3 Discussion *SPOILERS*

    Post by JGZinv on 10/15/2009, 12:31 pm

    Well maybe in the manga or novels... I don't know what Almael is referring to as a possible continuation... but for the anime I think BOTS3 shut the door pretty hard on the way out.

    It's got the whole "Sobash went and did this" Diaho did that" "Samson went on to" etc etc... at the end. So I don't think they intended to leave it open for another anime. It was to wrap up the loose ties for the anime fans.


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    Re: BOTS3 Discussion *SPOILERS*

    Post by tanis1lionheart on 10/15/2009, 12:33 pm

    I thought it did that so BotS4 could start out without any strings attached or something.
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    Re: BOTS3 Discussion *SPOILERS*

    Post by Almael on 10/15/2009, 1:18 pm

    JGZinv wrote:I don't know what Almael is referring to as a possible continuation... but for the anime I think BOTS3 shut the door pretty hard on the way out.

    I refered to the 4th Bots novel (translation found here:
    http://www.baka-tsuki.org/project/index.php?title=Seikai_no_Senki

    I agree that Bandai, probably tried to close it with Bots3 while still holding the options for more.
    The problem just lies in sales and top brass decision, and Morioka.
    There seem to be no problem on the side of publishers and animators.

    So we are waiting for the 5th Bots novel and Bots4+ anime.
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    Re: BOTS3 Discussion *SPOILERS*

    Post by AlexT on 10/15/2009, 6:25 pm

    JGZinv wrote:Well having watched the bento version of the movie...
    I'm not sure what to say. On one hand is was a good ending, but a very sad ending.
    I can understand why AN died like it did after the movie came out, plus the internal problems... a lot of that makes sense now. There wasn't much to talk about further... the largest topics were nailed dead due to the movie wrapping up ties.
    Yep, AN ended because offical info ran out and there were too few creative people. Most just wasn't interested in any speculations, theories and fan created stuff. Many like show what i call "in a wrong way".
    While Bots3 wasn't all that rich on events - it played important role by introducing modern animation level. At least BOTS won't get left behind just because it never made it to "next era" of anime. If it didn't - the show would be declared old and forgotten among older classics and it would be real hard to persuade investros/producers whatever. But at least they have something to show that is up to modern level. (thanks to Retas Pro for coming out just in time - i'm not sure they'd even bother making BOTS3 with old analogue cell technique).
    Of course we're still here...
    But some observations:
    Lafiel and Jinto have an understood love for each other. Jinto being softer on the outside, harder on the inside... while Lafiel is the reverse. They've evidently decided on children.
    A weird love. Jinto and Lafiel's "love" must be the most boring by anime standards. I had to explain it all to a certain girl cuz she didn't get it. And when she did - she said a briliant thing: " i guess he doesn't want her or he prefer men, otherwise i don't get it". While our little robot is naturaly waiting for guy to take action - the guy is just not up to the task. I have no idea what will happen in bots 4, but Jinto & Lafiel romantic story run out of gas in bots 3 - show must find something other to focus on. But btw - it was good enging by show standards, imho.
    Their relationship has changed after him nearly dying on Lobnas II, and
    also it appears to have changed some due to age. I'd almost say that
    Lafiel, and maybe it's the Japanese language verses listening to the
    dub, but was hard and bitter. Very few times unless they were "having a
    moment" did she display as much as previous animations. I was sort of
    taken aback by this... wishing for the desperate emotional Lafiel.
    But it would be wrong because she isn't. Bots 3 Lafiel is exactly what she should be if we consider overal story/anime style. Older parts were made with generic anime tricks in mind, bots 3 is closer to the books imho - more realistic approach, more mature. And finaly - there wasn't any emotinal moment for her to be emotional, don't you think?
    Miss. E (since I can't spell her name) drives like a psychopath, and seems to have shed her cutesy exterior in favor of being blunt, kinda rude, and addicted to speed. Pretty sure she was hoping Jinto would do something to her in the "dead" communication's ship.
    Miss E. is actualy briliant - no other character represent Abhs to such extreme "abhness" as she does. She and miss S. are pinacles of the show. Jinto should have used that opportunity, but oh - it's "the Jinto" i'm talking about
    Ultimately I just about had a heart attack at the ending when Till wanted him to seek asylum and abandon the Abh. The concept sent me into a shock, hoping he wouldn't consider it. The next scene flashed through - or maybe it was poor editing... faster than I could really grasp what had happened and suddenly they were to the point of signing documents.
    Till is a low down dirty.... whatever.. from what I remember he
    actually helped turn Rock Lin over to have him murdered. Now he spins
    the story like he was a saint. He corner's Jinto, taking away that
    which he had longed for so dearly... not just for himself, but to be
    with Lafiel on his home world. Till sickens me. It was entirely a power
    play by him to retain his power over Martine... he cared nothing for
    Jinto, even with the hugging. To even go so far as to even banish him
    from the area...
    You should be sick about Jinto. Not to manipulate such a stupid weakling would be a crime.
    Unfortunately unlike in other anime - his type doesn't get beaten for being what he is. He's better in book, but in anime he's total zero. Another thing that make it all look artifical to me - while Lafiel is not the most agressive "fighter" type girl - she's strong enough not to become found of weaklings. And in bots 3 she actualy getting struck by romance during Jinto's most epic failure. It's not what author wanted to prove however - he tried to show that Jinto is ready to abandon the most precious of what he have just to stay with Lafiel, but it didn't turn out very well, imho.

    Finaly, about future seikai anime possible - i think the book itself is the biggest problem. What's good for book - not always good for anime. If someone just took Seikai world and made show with independent storyline - it would work (commercial wise), but bots3 proved that story is going in direction anime cannot follow successfully.

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    Re: BOTS3 Discussion *SPOILERS*

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