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    Lost Stories Character arts and details.

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    Almael
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by Almael on 11/14/2009, 2:08 pm

    I moved my last three posts on the weapons to a new "Scifi weapons" thread.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Some more new additions on characters


    A young Almael, created for the Senki PC game. Appears in Lost Story 03 part 2.


    The current Almael, created for the Senki PC game.


    Originally a WIP created for Plakia for the Senki PC game, but was too good to dismiss.
    So she will be used as Mia in Lost Story 03 part 1.


    Planned for the genetic mother of the Abh girl in Lost Story 03 part 2. She may be dropped.


    A cadidate for Samiora in Lost Story 03 part 2. I'm trying to create a woman with short hair, but this turned out to be more difficult as there aren't many sources to use.


    A candidate for Spaurh Asen (Penege's mother) or the Lady in Lost Story 03 part 2.
    I tend to lean for the Lady.


    A bonus character for Ramaje's mother, ex-Empress Lameiar.

    This concludes me trying to get more women into the story to balance the lack from the previous ones.
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by AlexT on 11/14/2009, 3:55 pm

    Nice Did you make these from scratch or they are based on some existing characters from other sources?
    It's good to have something as a base for any drawings and art Smile Too bad i'm too deep into learning traditional art atm (if you can call it 2ce per week) to make quick CGI things myself In the end it's better - until i get to some good level it's no point making any "final" drawings - i'm saving all my ideas for the later Smile

    Still 1 thing (something made using totaly new method for me) i'll post very soon and 1 "bigger" thing is in production...

    How do you think - would it be ok for illustrations if they were in completely traditional realistic style instead of anime? Funny - i wanted to learn about art more to make something in anime style yet as i learned i became fascinated by realistic (or semi-realistic) stuff even more , like on covers of sci-fi books (especialy older ones), concept art etc...
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by Almael on 11/14/2009, 4:51 pm

    Thanks.
    They are all based on some sources. This is because I don't want to spend too much time creating new stuff. Usually I do invent things for sprite animations.
    Anyway, the above are 50% from changing existing sources and rearranging them, eg. changing color pallets for hair/eyes, creating the desired hair style, complete the face/expression, recreate the cloth. Usually this means each picture needs about ten+ working steps and about 4-5 layers.

    More to come soon (relative. Very Happy )
    --------
    I will be awaiting for your exhibition. Smile

    Well, since I don't have a tablet, I prefer to do anime style. But from the way I do it doesn't make much of a different if it were another style.
    When I draw by hand I prefere realistic drawing. I'm good as far as a non-artist can be. Wink
    But imho it's not to trouble to draw anime or techincal either. I just don't draw anime/ comics as much.

    Anyway, I do CGs for fun about once a month at best. So I'm not particularly trained. My artistry just covers my lack well. Embarassed
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by AlexT on 11/14/2009, 6:26 pm

    It's realy easy to manipulate existing anime pictures. I'm not talking about that modified Lafiel of mine which i done in like 5 minutes, but even on it if you look at her "modified" eye - unaware person would not detect the change i think so if you have any ideas that could come to life by modifying existing pic let me know - compared to the stuff i have to do regularly it's easy, i just haven't came with any good idea, but there's some potential in "faking" Seikai screenshots if done right. Modifying and combining details in existing scenes is easiest (face expression of character, clothes, details on the space ship, details of interior etc) but i can try adding totaly new character into scene. If you'll come across any interesting idea (and suitable screenshots) - let me know, it's quick and fun.
    The only reason why i didn't do some is because i came up with different idea...you'll see it soon.

    As for realistic art - some time ago when i decided to learn traditional art i came to a conclusion that bringing seikai "into real world" would be a task worth of efforts, especialy since i'm learning it anyway. So what i mean is if it's good idea to concentrate on realistic Seikai illustrations? After all Seikai was always anime/manga, even books had comic style illustrations... After many people that like Seikai are into anime..
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by Almael on 11/21/2009, 8:21 pm

    Almael on Sun Nov 15, 2009 12:03 am wrote:I see.
    Well, creating
    simple scenes only means the characters have to do simple things which
    will end up making it less interesting eg. dialogues, small tasks.
    If
    you really want one good idea for simple background scene then imagine
    how Lafiel performs in a kitchen. This should give you plenty of ideas
    what she can do or not do.
    You can even provide fan service. *Ahem*

    Realistic
    Seikai is certainly possible and worth a try. The problem is obviously
    finding a way to translate anime style into realistic features. As you
    have already done, it's a bit difficult since we have no real basis.
    Mostly
    the new art will have more lines and these may potentially make them
    look bad. I guess I will try one for show. Maybe my approach gives you
    ideas. It's easier to do than explain.
    Though, I have no idea what to explain. Razz Of course I will try to use existing sources. (The new invisible vector lines in Adoby illustrators is driving me crazy.)
    I guess I will do a man (Almael) and a woman (Spoor).

    OK, here's the WIP for Spoor

    I need to redo the hair part. I will have to experiment with the nose. I don't seem to be able to make the eyes better, though.
    I haven't decided yet on the cloth's top style:
    -should it be approbriate for a grand duchess with some traditional flair?
    -or should it be provocative like her personality?
    -or back to a uniform with a sword?


    another version for Samiora or just a random woman...


    UMK's feared military elite bug.

    planned for Next:
    Naro, the Abh childcare mechanical AI cat
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by AlexT on 11/23/2009, 7:55 am

    Gone creative i see? Very Happy Good, i see what you mean with Spoor, i'll get to her soon too, just need to try a few faces to find the right feel - drawing existing anime characters (especially heavily stylized) is always tricky - easy to loose original feel of the character.
    Oh, i hate bugs, UMK is so evil, no wonder they use insects Wink

    Anyway - i made a real quick sketch in near-realistic style here at work while waiting for my coffee - ignore the pencil mess, only face is real important here (and i hope you like ponytails) Wink If you like face/hair type i'll take it into concept level and see how it will work in details:


    And rough color if it helps preview, again - ignore the mess:
    http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/5673/almaelcolor.jpg
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by Almael on 11/23/2009, 7:55 pm

    Looks like your quick sketching is getting better, although, I don't think the alien hand/fingers are right. LOL
    Although, I have considered a tail, I don't really like it in any practical sense. I prefere either normal short hair or shoulder long.
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by AlexT on 11/24/2009, 6:40 am

    It's not important Wink What important is visual description of admiral: his overall look, mood, gestures he prefer, pose etc. This gives idea of how he'd look in other poses, what his facial expressions would be in certain situations etc. If you like overall look i'll make things right with hands and stuff.

    Hmm, maybe cleaning sketche is bad idea - all the initial messy lines help to establish form and flow, once cleaned it loose a lot of life. Hand was more messy first and if it would stay so it would look more natural as immagination kicks-in.
    Ok, i'll do better version with different hair or couple variants and we'll see.
    Some other chars too, i just need to get my wacom to work under win 7 - it doesn't behave right for some reason...
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by Almael on 11/24/2009, 12:35 pm

    Well, normally start from pose, gesture and then expression and other details. But for each it's a good idea to have drawn 'protoypes' you could reuse for others. This is like a database or archive or 'toolkit' for art.
    I think messy or not depends of style. You draw for either one. For each there are different tricks to accoplish the same while there are some only one could do.
    Creating natural and immagination needs skillz. Making some line doesn't call forth imagination it needs some dynamics and 'common sense' of the people to recognize it. If you got that ability I don't think you need to learn more about drawing.
    I don't mind any style as long as it's acceptable. Like women each one has it's own charm.
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by AlexT on 11/24/2009, 1:03 pm

    Oh, don't say, i hear it quite often Wink They say it will all fix itself with time and experience. We'll see.
    So far hands are still a problem, but hey - even Jason Chan in his tutorials says it's a problem for him - it's as hard as drawing the rest of the body altogether, i guess it's alright for me then Razz

    As for hair styles - you mean like these? Which one would be better?
    http://img98.imageshack.us/i/almaelbwshort.jpg/
    http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/9237/almaelbwlong.jpg
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by Almael on 11/24/2009, 4:13 pm

    Fingers, lips, eyes, nose

    Yep, shot is alright, as to long I was thinking of these:

    but not fluffy
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by AlexT on 11/24/2009, 4:40 pm

    There's nothing wrong with anything on face except for brows a bit high but i consider it abh feature - even in anime this difference is shown..

    So you want him to have beard? Hm, i haven't thought about it, should look cool.
    I see the type of face you mean, even though it's very close (overal type) ok, i'll make new one, looks like i got my wacom working well again
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by Almael on 11/25/2009, 8:35 am

    ^_^
    Beard is nice, but with a young face like the Abhs it's a bit out of place (maybe). But if any beard I think this style is alright.
    Try two version of this beard style
    1 around the chin only
    2 plus reaching to the ears like in the picture
    Which one would look better?
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by AlexT on 11/26/2009, 6:25 pm

    For sake of experiment I tried to get close to pics you posted and just add a bit of "abh element" and result already feels "too european". I'll try to do the same thing i done to hecto-commander i'm working atm and add Japanese features, mainly eyes and jaw shape - it works like a charm. Funny thing is - Japanese face types still look more anime even in realistic drawing compared to pure european (i.e.english ) face types.
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by Almael on 11/28/2009, 1:39 pm

    Almael on Thu Nov 26, 2009 11:19 pm wrote:
    Hmm, I see what you mean. Look older too...
    We need a real young guy's face as reference.
    The
    thing you can fix now is drawing more beard above the lips and make the
    hair behind the neck go outward with lines. Round lines make it look
    feminine. Since Abh are beautiful it not a problem if the face is
    feminine but that's why I think it may be more important to express
    gender with hair style. *shrug*


    A quick line sketch for Naro.

    The head is a bit too big, the lower legs are a bit short, I also left out the rest of the tail. I couldn't get the ears as I wanted, but all in all this is about it.
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by AlexT on 11/28/2009, 6:51 pm

    Isn't it easier to assume he has a shape and almost a look of a real cat? And it probably should have a fur and stuff with some noticeable differences?

    I tried to imagine and experiment a little - the animals like cat was among first i supposedly learned drawing and i also couldn't miss an opportunity to have fun so i added terminator cat face as well Very Happy
    This is x-ray view of sorts, the overall shape is very close to real cat as you see. He doesn't wear tiara as it may seem but has some similar looking triangle thing to help identify it as a friend for a child. It also has a white stripes (while most "fur" is dark blue)

    Here's couple of fun links as well:
    http://www.sharecg.com/images/medium/3015.jpg
    http://www.techchee.com/img/exploded-robot-cat-gets-frozen-011207.jpg
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by Almael on 11/29/2009, 9:47 am

    Nice sketches. (btw. the lower legs should be folded when sitting)
    edit: I think the sitting pic is a dog.

    AlexT wrote:Isn't it easier to assume he has a shape and almost a look of a real cat? And it probably should have a fur and stuff with some noticeable differences?
    Like this(2007)? or this? (It wasn't giving me the idea. I just chose a cat.)
    Edit: Details for Necoro or Yume Neko Smile

    Well, although, I said 'cat' this mechanoid is big. The reason is it has to be able to take care of babies/kids. It needs big enough hands and body. I used folded fingers to keep the overall size small. Also this makes the hand look more like a paw. It's about 70 cm or nearly 30 inches long. Weights in at 20-25kg.
    I think the cat must be easy to use and maintain, prefereable no maintainance required. After all the parents are likely not to have the time to take care of the child less the cat. It must not look scary. I think fur would be nice, but messy to take care of. It would have to be glassfiber in order to use light as energy, but they break off easy and become a health danger.
    *scratch* I think it has to be either with fur or without. Having fur at certain places only look weird.
    Since it's an expansive product, I guess, both versions are available for the Naro cat series. So do have the one you like.

    i also couldn't miss an opportunity to have fun so i added terminator cat face as well
    Terminator is too primitive a design for the neck (too stiff).

    He doesn't wear tiara as it may seem but has some similar looking triangle thing to help identify it as a friend for a child. It also has a white stripes (while most "fur" is dark blue)
    A triangle-like blinking light? It would certaily attrack child's attention.
    Anyway, I wanted it to have max. computer power I could squeeze into the head and main body. So I just used normal Abh thought crystal shape they wear. Main body has the main databanks, expansions, emergency processing units.
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by AlexT on 11/29/2009, 6:48 pm

    Yeah, i too came to a conclusion that either it look like real cat or totaly not and more like robot - like on pics i posted.
    Terminator was just for fun so i didn't spend time on it Smile
    The triangle - can be just a paint of different color of fur. Just like all abh toys have "tiara" on them (bears, birds etc.)

    And those videos - yeah, they explain how my "version" would probably look in real life - cat with clear artificial feel to it Smile
    Btw, it's not as bad...at least on looks and realism... I think cat can have fur of some specific material that make solar-power possible... it's distant future sci-fi, let's just assume it? Very Happy Cuz it's almost impossible to make him look robotic and attractive/interesting at the same time. But it's your call.

    And about characters - do you have some pic - not anime but a real photo of actor/celebrity whatever that look like any of your characters? Post something that would be the most accurate match for at least 1 please...
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by Almael on 11/30/2009, 10:39 am

    AlexT wrote:I think cat can have fur of some specific material that make solar-power possible... it's distant future sci-fi, let's just assume it? Very Happy Cuz it's almost impossible to make him look robotic and attractive/interesting at the same time. But it's your call.
    Sure, then it's synthetic fur should be able to grow different colors. Wink We need synthetic skin , too.
    I don't know what you think is attractive in this case but I like the lynx, hence, the antenna ears. Wink
    I like both version actually, as a kid I would choose the fur, as a man I wouldn't mind without fur. (indecisive two-timer )


    And about characters - do you have some pic - not anime but a real photo of actor/celebrity whatever that look like any of your characters?
    I didn't have any real person in mind when I thought them up, but I will try to look for some.


    Edit: I just came across this

    , for some reason I think she looks good for Spoor.


    Last edited by Almael on 11/30/2009, 3:12 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by AlexT on 11/30/2009, 12:48 pm

    Check link - not working Sad
    But better not one of official seikai characters - those will need real careful work in future, pick something for your own characters first Wink They do not exist in anime form so there's nothing to compare em to - less expectations to meet.

    Yes, skin is logical too - you can just have solid mechanical parts
    behind some skin which is like some extra-strong cloth. The cat need to
    be soft just because of safety also hard surface almost instantly feels
    alien and will never be associated with living being.
    Question is - is it more like cloth or silicon artificial skin?
    I'll try different version, just need to figure out how to draw what i have in mind better ...
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by Almael on 11/30/2009, 3:29 pm

    link fixed.
    Alright, I will try to grab someone as soon as possible.

    I think metallic skin is still needed to keep form and mechanical movement from damaging internal things.
    The skin will be some kind of matrx...'regenimer'Wink
    it will feel like a combination of wax and rubber. The hair will be produced(grow from) small pores in which a small nano chemical factories do the work. So the skin will need some white fluid for blood.
    The metalic shell is a semi-translucent alumina-polymer-ceramic which is elastic but very tough to 'cut' and likely to return back to it's form.
    Hmm, the legs have variable tension spring-material for higly efficient energy return when running and climbing.
    The lower feet are normal feet, only the hands have hands. The design for the ears I planned would make them turn toward the back, making the cat look fast or a cat aggressive stance.
    Hmm, a small tube in the lower jaw is used to suck fluid(water).
    That will be all that's 'visible'. I didn't plan an anus hole, but if you got a good idea for it's use...
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by AlexT on 12/5/2009, 9:04 am

    For example my reference for Wadrosal: Very Happy
    http://img264.imageshack.us/img264/7521/86280629.jpg

    Since i'm trying to add japanese element to faces i think i'll end up with 70% european faces with slight feel of Japanese, i figured out what realy add this feel - it's brows, eyes and more rough (as opposed to curvy) lines at bottom of the face.
    You think it would be good idea or it's not visualy that obvious in Abhs ?

    For cat - i'm waiting for disk of a library of concept art to arrive, i'm sure i saw a lot of mechanic cats and creatures in preview. I also came to a conclusion that cat should consist of many details in order for it's body to be flexible or he would not be able to climb trees and perform complex manuvers etc. Which means if he's without hair he won't have that clean look of AIBO robots and stuff - he'll be like terminator, with tons of moving parts so either he's having "scales" like plates all over his body (which would make him look like dragon or fish) or there's no avoiding fur which would be most elegant... solution Very Happy
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by Almael on 12/5/2009, 11:16 am

    I see. Very Happy
    I'm still trying to find suitable people...I have saved many pics from all over the place...maybe some will do.

    Ya, the differences are minor when reduced to art. Mostly it will have to depend on perception.
    I think it's not that obvious in Abh, because I believe the ideal Abh beauty is closer to female faces we see in japanese celebrities and bishies.
    The problem is that this asian ideal isn't quite the same as western but all the same not too different either. The most visible difference is maybe the form of the face. Asian's seem to be either rounder or less wide. European more edged and wider. But then again most people look at the composition of eyes, nose, lips etc.

    Oh, I'm curious about that library.

    Well, it's not that much more complex. Of course engineers want to reduce everything to the least number of 'freedom' needed. This will reduce complexity and all kinds of problems.
    As I see it, the majority of intersection points need at max 2 axis.
    There is no need for scales, just some plate section as I have sketched before. There may not be a need for intermediate material to connect those either.
    So it needs some more sections and axis compared to Aibo, but not too much.
    For falling and turning like a real cat, all there need is an internal flywheel Wink
    For climbing it only need to spread the arms and maybe legs to the side. Maybe a bit of sideway movement of the body. Most important are the hands/paw because they need to adjust to the angle of the surface. So these must have two axis.
    Except for legs, and neck the degree of movement isn't much for the body or tail sections. Maybe only 10-20 degrees each.

    simple mechanical design sketch

    The most problem I see is mechanical strength, toughness, quickness, and leg design.
    Cats, horses etc have 3 section legs (actually their hand is extended) and most design reduce it to two section. This works well, but does not look like real.


    sample cheeta
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by AlexT on 12/5/2009, 11:53 am

    This cheeta is good. It's what i had in mind but couldn't "localize" to actualy see it in drawing because of natural association with living cats. (The approach to drawing living and mechanical things is very different).
    I think it can still use "scales" in some areas like neck and back - to protect it's mechanical/electronic insides. Skull is definately solid, the body is mostly like real cat skeleton to which we add some kind of flexible skin that remind latex but is hard and durable and then there's fur "growing" out of it and we have the cat.
    His overal shape should be closer to this cheetah/panther as well cuz he's large compared to house cat.
    So in the end - it is closer to terminator ideas, the only reason it should be more simply made is cost -after all this cat is no terminator but a babysitter Wink
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    Re: Lost Stories Character arts and details.

    Post by Almael on 12/5/2009, 12:53 pm



    If you just have skin over a skeleton then it will carve in, so real harder skin beneat is needed.
    some more example to flexiblility



    As you see there is no need for complex scales, just smart designed sections is enough.

    some places:
    http://www.geekologie.com/mt/mt-search.cgi?tag=burn%20it%20with%20fire!&IncludeBlogs=1
    http://blog.rj55.com/2009_03_01_archive.html

    Yep, no terminator, but still better in design. geek

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